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Power problem on first gen UPDATE 3/13/23

3K views 23 replies 5 participants last post by  Satito 
#1 · (Edited)
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Finally I have hit a wall I don’t seem to be capable of figuring my way around without creating an account and using my Ask the Audience lifeline. Let me get y”all caught up, and then I have a huge favor to ask all, or one (or any Number in between) of you. It is quite long, so get comfy cozy…

Approximately may of 2021 my boyfriend bought an automotive rooftop tent (one of the Free Spirit Recreation ones, it is very nice) for $2,300 and in doing so he also purchased the automobile it was mounted to. He immediately swapped the tent onto our F150 and then excitedly presented me with my “brand new (to you) 2000 nissan Xterra se!”
Our friend that sold us the car had told him that the power steering had a leak somewhere, the fuel gauge didn’t move (SPOILER: it did) but other than that the car drove like a dream(SPOILER: it did not) thankfully my boyfriend had insisted on taking it on a test drive and scanning her OBDII before any money changed hands. Which is how we found out that it had a code for mass air flow sensor, and knock sensor, which after a quick google he declared not a big deal.
my boyfriend did the knock sensor relocation for me, and we together did spark plugs (holyhell that #6 plug is a punishment from god levels of hard to get to), I did the MAS myself, we together swapped the power steering lines and then everything got even less awesome.
so around September after I finished the plugs my boyfriend walked me through doing an oil change, and I changed the fuel filter seemingly for the car’s very first time. As I was wrapping up the oil change he left to run to Lowe’s and forgot his wallet at home. I knew that two things had happened,1. He left with 7 minutes to get to a store that closed in 10 minutes, and 2. He left his wallet at home.
so overly confident I hopped in the Xterra and drove the seven blocks to meet him, and as I came to a stop to turn into the Lowe’s parking lot the Xterra died, luckily my boyfriend was pulling out, and we were together able to push it through the intersection, and then later tow the thing back home. For brevity’s sake I will spare you the lead up to December when I gave up on my original engine and ordered a replacement.
I got my original motor out and my new (to me) motor in place in only a month and a half, and yesterday finally was satisfied that everything was connected correctly, adjusted right, and ready to try the keys for the first time, which I fully expected to be the most exciting crank of my life…
But of course not, there is no power, to anything at all in the car. I took the starter back off and tested it to see if it works, and holy shit does it work. I double checked the ground cables, and they all seem fine. We are about to go grab a multi meter and see if maybe the brand new positive cable has damage under the insulation, and then just for fun we are gonna swap the equally brand new terminals for the originals to see if maybe the brass isn’t conductive enough?
However because my boyfriend has asked me 10,000,000,000 times if I am sure I have everything plugged in, I am starting to think that maybe I don’t? Would someone, anyone, pretty please be willing to grab their phone and take a video starting at the battery and walking through the wiring harness(es) in the engine bay just briefly showing me where there are connectors and what they connect to? Just so I can be sure I didn’t mess it up somewhere obvious before I give up, wipe down the inside and sell the thing to someone who has any clue what they are doing because clearly I do not? You’d be my hero.

EDIT on 03/13/2023: I am also adding this as a reply but thought I would put it up top to make it easier for new readers to find where I’m at.
Yesterday I made it to autozone and bought a replacement 100amp fuse and did my main battery fuse. while I had everything torn apart in the fuse box I tested for continuity and from the positive battery to the starter is good, as well as the starter plug back up to the fuse box. Both the body and the engine block are grounded, and my boyfriend used a multimeter to check both of the 80amp fuses in the fuse box, which looked rough but tested good. After everything was all hooked back up I turned on my hazards (as they should always draw power reglardless of the ignition) aaaaaand, nothing.
For good measure I swapped out the quick connect battery terminals I had bought off Amazon for the original terminals that aren’t made of brass, just to be sure I had a good connection for the cables at the posts. Still nothing.
I literally don’t have a clue what I could be missing.
 
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#2 ·
I can offer something better than that, and it's free! Download the FSMs for your model year and you'll get not only the wiring diagrams, but all the other stuff you need to know as well.


Oh, and congratulations on the new-to-you rig, and kudos on keeping up on the maintenance!
 
#3 ·
While I appreciate the help, I assure you that I have spent a cumulative 40 hours pouring over the service manuals since Terra and I got stuck together and yet still . Mostly they are crazy helpful, but when I get to the sections on electrical issues my brain just breaks and I can’t translate or retain an ounce of data.
hence the request for a wiring harness/connectors walk through. My thought was that if I could see the information in addition to reading it I might be able to catch something i missed when reassembling Her.
mince the sun comes back up I’m gonna start rechecking the fuse block.
 
#4 ·
In simple terms, you turn the key, then the PNP (park/neutral position) relay passes the power to the starter solenoid, which spins it up.

On vehicles with SECU (smart entrance control unit), there is an additional relay that can allow or prevent the engine from starting. It does this by disabling the PNP.

The only wires you need to worry about take a fairly straight path to the starter.

On my 2004 V6 non-SC VG33E the wiring may be different, so please compare what follows with the diagram for your vehicle.

The first wire is the obvious battery cable.
Second is the Black/Red wire from the PNP to the solenoid. If you energize this wire, the starter should spin.
Third is the Black/Yellow wire from the key to the PNP. If the PNP is energized, it passes power out to the B/R wire above.

There is a 40A fuse that feeds the key, a 10A fuse for the PNP, and another 10A fuse for the SECU (if equipped).

You also want to be sure that your grounds are clean and tight, as always.

Here's a handy chart of the wire colors used by Nissan.
 
#5 ·
so, my concern which I feel like I maybe didn’t properly articulate, is that NOTHING has power, locks, lights, nothing. If I still had dash/other lights but the stupid car wouldn’t start (like I had pre motor replacement) I wouldn’t be as upset/confounded.
Am I correct in my understanding that the only things that should prevent my brake lights and/or hazards from working so long as my battery has a charge and cables are connected correctly are:
1. A short in the wiring between the positive terminal and the negative
2. The ECU being toast?

also, thank you, again, for taking the time to respond but also for doing such a good job of not making my brain feel like it is full of Xterra flavored pudding instead of information. This has been the most emotionally exhausting car experience of my life, and I lived in a PT Cruiser for like three months a few years ago!
 
#7 · (Edited)
No power to anything sounds like the main battery fuse might be blown.

It is not uncommon for it to blow if you accidentally short the battery lines (or hook up jumper cables backwards... don't ask how I know :rolleyes:). Accidentally hooking up the battery backward will also blow this fuse. It will be in the fuse box behind the battery under the hood. It's either 40 or 80 Amps, I don't recall exactly. It can be a pain to replace, as there is a special cover that has to come off in order to access the screw that holds the fuse in place (it goes through the metal leg of the fuse. You can get a replacement from Autozone or another place for fairly cheap ( I think mine was under $8). I don't recommend getting an OEM fuse, unless you have money to burn.

There are some videos online that show how to replace this fuse.
 
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#8 · (Edited)
Just checked. It's an 80Amp on the 2.4L (my Frontier is 2.4L). The 3.3L will have a 160Amp. You can't miss it. THe fuse is located in the middle of the fuse block. If that fuse is blown the entire vehicle will act like there is no battery in the vehicle at all. Nothing will power up.
 
#9 ·
UPDATE: Yesterday I made it to autozone and bought a replacement 100amp fuse and did my main battery fuse. while I had everything torn apart in the fuse box I tested for continuity and from the positive battery to the starter is good, as well as the starter plug back up to the fuse box. Both the body and the engine block are grounded, and my boyfriend used a multimeter to check both of the 80amp fuses in the fuse box, which looked rough but tested good. After everything was all hooked back up I turned on my hazards (as they should always draw power reglardless of the ignition) aaaaaand, nothing.
For good measure I swapped out the quick connect battery terminals I had bought off Amazon for the original terminals that aren’t made of brass, just to be sure I had a good connection for the cables at the posts. Still nothing.
I literally don’t have a clue what I could be missing
 
#10 · (Edited)
I think the best road forward is to gradually work your way down the positive line and test for power at each connection. Test using the chassis of the vehicle as your negative, not the battery terminal. Also test different parts of the chassis, engine, etc to make sure that it is all grounded. With your car in park/neutral try jumping the starter with the starter installed. Just jump from the positive terminal on the battery to the positive terminal on the starter. Careful of the fan belt and pulleys of course. This will tell you if you have good ground at the starter.

You can also jump from the negative terminal to a metal part of the chassis to test if the main ground strap is bad.

Check the chassis/frame where the ECM is mounted for ground. You may also want to check the ECM relay. It's located in the center console on top of the ECM.

Tracking down electrical issues can be a very frustrating thing. Slow and methodical generally the best way to go. Start at your battery and work your way out from there, testing as you go.
 
#11 ·
I think the best road forward is to gradually work your way down the positive line and test for power at each connection. Test using the chassis of the vehicle as your negative, not the battery terminal. Also test different parts of the chassis, engine, etc to make sure that it is all grounded. With your car in park/neutral try jumping the starter with the starter installed. Just jump from the positive terminal on the battery to the positive terminal on the starter. Careful of the fan belt and pulleys of course. This will tell you if you have good ground at the starter.

You can also jump from the negative terminal to a metal part of the chassis to test if the main ground strap is bad.

Check the chassis/frame where the ECM is mounted for ground. You may also want to check the ECM relay. It's located in the center console on top of the ECM.

Tracking down electrical issues can be a very frustrating thing. Slow and methodical generally the best way to go. Start at your battery and work your way out from there, testing as you go.
Thank you so much for your response, yesterday I was almost ready to throw in the towel and sell the thing as is. Just a couple more questions if it isn’t too much to ask:
Where is the main ground strap located? I’ve located several grounds, the two that connect to the intake manifold, the ones that go to the fenders, and the one up behind the fuse box, which is the main ground, or am I missing one? Is the ECM above or below the radio in the center console? The guy I got this piece of cough car, from had pulled the radio when he decided to sell it. Maybe the Ecm will be the first thing that isn’t a pain in the ass to get to!
 
#16 · (Edited)
The ECM is located below the radio. It's actually mounted on the "hump", which is why if you drown your gen1 in deep water there is a tendency for ECM issues (Obviously this requires water coming into the cabin and being deep enough to cover the hump, but it does happen.

They moved the ECM to high up on the passenger side of the engine compartment in the gen2 if I'm not mistaken.

I do wish that there was a diagram of all the ground straps. It's a question that gets asked a lot.

There should be bonding straps to the intake manifold, engine block, exhaust system etc. When in doubt you can always jump from the negative terminal to the various parts of the chassis and engine (avoid positive leads etc. when you do this).

The main concern would be the main ground strap that goes from the negative battery terminal to the chassis (inner fender in the engine compartment). If it doesn't have a good connection then you have no ground on the rest of the vehicle even if the other straps are in place. Also check to make sure that it's not corroded where it connects to the vehicle.

I would also test for power just on the other side of the battery quick connects that you installed (the wires leading out of them. DOn't test against the metal on the connectors themselves). I've had problems with quick connects in the past. I have one on my Frontier, because it was draining the battery for a while. The some times it would stay connected when the knob was turned out/off, and sometimes it would not be connected at all when it was turned in/on. It was just due to cheap parts (that I bought on Amazon).
 
#19 ·
The ECM is located below the radio. It's actually mounted on the "hump", which is why if you drown your gen1 in deep water there is a tendency for ECM issues (Obviously this requires water coming into the cabin and being deep enough to cover the hump, but it does happen.

They moved the ECM to high up on the passenger side of the engine compartment in the gen2 if I'm not mistaken.

I do wish that there was a diagram of all the ground straps. It's a question that gets asked a lot.

There should be bonding straps to the intake manifold, engine block, exhaust system etc. When in doubt you can always jump from the negative terminal to the various parts of the chassis and engine (avoid positive leads etc. when you do this).

The main concern would be the main ground strap that goes from the negative battery terminal to the chassis (inner fender in the engine compartment). If it doesn't have a good connection then you have no ground on the rest of the vehicle even if the other straps are in place. Also check to make sure that it's not corroded where it connects to the vehicle.

I would also test for power just on the other side of the battery quick connects that you installed (the wires leading out of them. DOn't test against the metal on the connectors themselves). I've had problems with quick connects in the past. I have one on my Frontier, because it was draining the battery for a while. The some times it would stay connected when the knob was turned out/off, and sometimes it would not be connected at all when it was turned in/on. It was just due to cheap parts (that I bought on Amazon).
Correct you are on the ECM relocation for Gen2.
 
#18 ·
There are also similar threads for the Frontier. Remember. Any time you look up info on the Xterra, look up the same info on the Frontier. Often there is more out there on the Frontier, or at you at least double your results. ClubFrontier is often a good source of info.


And here's one from our forum for Xterra. It ended up being the quick disconnect on the positive battery terminal.

 
#20 ·
Satito, you are a saint. To remove a potential point of failure I removed the quick connects and replaced them with basic tinned copper terminals. Inside of the insulation on the negative cable itself there is quite a bit of green powdery corrosion that appears to run its entirety. While it doesn’t appear to be preventing a decent connection at either the terminal or the body I have some extra battery cable/lugs lying around so I may just make a new negative.
I haven’t watched that video yet, however I was just out at the car pulling the center console plastics off to get ready to dig into it and when I went to pull the carpet out of my way from up under both the driver and passenger side foot wells (whatever that area is actually called) both sides had a surprisingly decent amount of moisture on both the carpet and the padding underneath it. I’m guessing that wherever the hell that water came from it is likely the cause of my problem?
 
#22 ·
Satito, you are a saint. To remove a potential point of failure I removed the quick connects and replaced them with basic tinned copper terminals. Inside of the insulation on the negative cable itself there is quite a bit of green powdery corrosion that appears to run its entirety. While it doesn’t appear to be preventing a decent connection at either the terminal or the body I have some extra battery cable/lugs lying around so I may just make a new negative.
I haven’t watched that video yet, however I was just out at the car pulling the center console plastics off to get ready to dig into it and when I went to pull the carpet out of my way from up under both the driver and passenger side foot wells (whatever that area is actually called) both sides had a surprisingly decent amount of moisture on both the carpet and the padding underneath it. I’m guessing that wherever the hell that water came from it is likely the cause of my problem?
That cable is the poster child for needing to be replaced!
 
#21 ·
The water could be a part of the issue. The only way to find out is to get at the ECM and check it over for signs of water damage. DO NOT disconnect or reconnect the ECM with the battery connected.

Water down in that area could be caused by a number of things. The ones that come to mind are.

1) The drain for the ac is clogged so the water is emptying inside the vehicle.
2) A leak in the heater core (though it would smell like coolant)
3) a missing or broken plug in the floor or firewall (usually about 1" around and plastic)
4) A leak in the windshield. The adhesive/sealant gets old and brittle as well as corrosion can cause the paint and sealant to lift and allow water through (I have this problem in my Frontier, but just haven't had time to fix it).
5) a leak in the rubber boot between the floor and the shifter. I'm not sure how the automatic is put together as I've never had mine off, but the manual in the frontier has a rubber mat with a boot on it to keep out the elements, and then the more ornamental rubber boot that you actually see inside the vehicle. Over time the rubber can get brittle and allow water from the road to splash up and get inside the vehicle.
 
#24 ·
Yeah, Follow that green copper to where it terminates. It's quite possible that the end is corroded and needs some scuffing to clean it up. Likewise, it never hurts to undo the main ground line from where it attaches to the chassis and make sure that there isn't corrosion and dirt in between the contact points. That includes the bolt the holds it down.
 
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