I am starting the design for making a shrock style front bumper.
I was wondering if I could get some pictures from the mounting points, winch mounting, inside of the bumper.

My brother is starting up a Fab shop in spokane, and if we can get the info we need we will be able to make them to sell.

We have already made sliders, and a rear bumper.

any photos or input would be great.

Where in Spokane is the shop going to be located?

Let's see some pics of the stuff you've already done too. (sounds cool)

Also, Welcome to the club! Why don't you head over to the new member section, and post up a nice little intro about yourself (with pics, we love pics, lol). And I'll let you know when the next local Spokane/CDA "meet & eat" is coming up, if you're interested.

let me know ill see what i can find.. im interested in buying soon im going to go to a shop in puyallup unless you guys have a better deal..

Yes, welcome. I'm in Spokane also and would like to see what you have already done.

Welcome! If you dig around in this forum you can find all sorts of information about what Xterra owners want and don't want in their bumpers to fine tune your product. Also of interest to you would the complaint thread about Shrockworks. Take note of how poorly they communicate with their clients and do the opposite and you're bound to get a good following here.

Very good points Nate.

I ordered a shrocks But I know I am going to be waiting I think 3-4 months is their timeline

Any pics of the rear bumper? Does it have a tire carrier? What kinda prices?

I am starting the design for making a shrock style front bumper.
I was wondering if I could get some pictures from the mounting points, winch mounting, inside of the bumper.

My brother is starting up a Fab shop in spokane, and if we can get the info we need we will be able to make them to sell.

We have already made sliders, and a rear bumper.

any photos or input would be great.


Maybe you could email Shrock, and ask him for the blue prints and specs to make copying them easier and more accurate?

:wink-big:

:laugh-big:

i was waiting for TJ to chime in.. LOL

Maybe you could email Shrock, and ask him for the blue prints and specs to make copying them easier and more accurate?

:wink-big:

TJ,

New guy here and I don't post much but I have been around long enough to know how willing you are to help folks with their mod questions.

I've noticed that you aren't one to encourage people who are thinking about fabbing their own bumpers. From reading some of your posts, it sounds like you've known a few people who have tried making their own bumpers and weren't satisfied with the results. If this is the case, and without knowing the problems one can run into when designing/building their own, I would think that working off of a proven design would be a reasonable approach.

It would be interesting to hear about the details of your experiences with custom bumpers.

Rokwel

Meh I got an arb the mounting is pretty simple yet strong enough it uses the factory bumper bolts going into the side of the frame horn and the tie down point from the factory gets turned into a bracket for 6 bolts total.

TJ,

New guy here and I don't post much but I have been around long enough to know how willing you are to help folks with their mod questions.

I've noticed that you aren't one to encourage people who are thinking about fabbing their own bumpers. From reading some of your posts, it sounds like you've known a few people who have tried making their own bumpers and weren't satisfied with the results. If this is the case, and without knowing the problems one can run into when designing/building their own, I would think that working off of a proven design would be a reasonable approach.

It would be interesting to hear about the details of your experiences with custom bumpers.

Rokwel

I think TJ is discouraging that fact that one shouldn't copy the design and mass produced them. If your making one, and only one. Go for it. But to profit from one's design is not right.

Its a little of both points really.

I HAVE seen a huge number of home made, and even fab shop bumpers that were poor designs...as being able to make nice welds doesn't mean you can DESIGN anything per se.

It doesn't mean you CAN'T of course, its merely a completely separate skill set.

Its like a guy who can drive nails and saw wood with the best of them designing a house....he can put it together from plans, but, he might not be the best guy to MAKE the plans, and so forth.

Now, just like the guy who can hammer and saw like a pro might make a house by copying the design of one he was familiar with...he may or may not realize what's important, and what's not....and, what might need to be changed for a particular site, etc.

This is why a lot of home made and one off designs are not as good as others....the prototype IS the final product.

Shrock for example is really a custom bumper designer, one who's just had a really hard time scaling up the operation to meet the large demand, hence the long lead times, etc.

ARB for example is a mass producer of bumpers, and has a short lead time....as they are all exactly the same, no BL versions, no hoop options, etc...one after the other are churned out, each exactly like the one before it....

...You want recovery points? You want it for a BL? You want different hoops? Too bad, it doesn't have them, and so forth...they make one version, take it or leave it.



The ADVANTAGE to a bumper made en masse is that they tend to have had the bugs worked out, and the use of jigs, etc, make them more consistent, and line up better, etc.


KMA for example is another custom bumper maker, like Shrockworks. They make each one by hand, one at a time, and they are sometimes crooked, etc...BECAUSE they are all essentially custom one off fabrications....even though the design is being re-used.


So - As mentioned, if I were to copy something you spent years coming up with, and use it just for myself, that's OK in my book...imitation = flattery, etc.


If I were to copy your design, and then sell it as a competing business, that's not ok in my book, that's really stealing....and there are laws that essentially state that.


If I liked your design, but made my own measurements, and made my own original design, etc....its not as blatant, but, can still be considered as infringement if too close.



So - The bottom line is that its morally wrong to steal someone else's design, and then make copies of it to sell.


And, if you are making a one-off original bumper design, consider how important it is that it is well designed, and, what credentials the one designing it HAS to DESIGN bumpers.

MAKING bumpers for a long time does NOT constitute expertise, just experience.

I have seen bumpers made by people who "Have made 100's of custom bumpers" that are pretty poorly designed....and which have been heavy duty looking, but which don't protect what they're supposed to in an impact, due to design flaws, even if the metal is thick, and the welds are a work of art.

I have also seen some gems in that context as well...but, the point is, its a crap shoot.

I like to ENCOURAGE people to get custom bumpers for one primary reason - They can get what THEY want, with THEIR priorities in mind.

If they go to a good fabricator, or ARE a good fabricator, etc...a good fabricator, in ADDITION to being a good welder, etc...will be good at designing what you want.

This includes understanding the trade offs between weight and strength, what you want protection FROM, winching load aspects, approach angles, engine cooling, mounting options, and so forth.

NOT being adept at all of the above can result is a very strong, very heavy bumper that hangs so low that you can't get over rocks because it bangs them with a cow catcher-like approach angle....

...or a light-weight tube bumper that has the tubes leveraged so as to cantilever forces in an impact,

...or Beefy looking tubes that are too thin walled to actually provide real protection, and so forth.


So, again, a custom bumper can be the BEST bumper for YOU, or, it can be a poor design that looks good until tested.

:wink-big:

So, again, a custom bumper can be the BEST bumper for YOU, or, it can be a poor design that looks good until tested.

:wink-big:

TJ,

The sarcasm about stealing the creative work of others was definitely appreciated (I'm a mechanical designer) but I've read several posts in the past that led me to believe that you have in-depth experience backing up your brief statements about "homegrown" bumpers. I've been working on my own design for several months now and I couldn't resist asking. Thanks for elaborating.

Sorry to hijack the thread, I figured that TJ's response would be useful info to anyone designing their own bumpers.


Rokwel

I was looking for more of the mounting points for the bumper. i have my own ideas of what i was going to do, the other designs were to get ideas from to possiblely expand upon.

Wasn't planning on copying piece by piece for the bumper. it was more for getting ideas from tested designs.

I started by looking at the stock bumper mounts then I searched through the build threads looking for aftermarket bumper installs. There aren't many clear shots of the mounts, but there are enough to get a good idea of how other maunfacturers do it. It just takes time to find them. I would provide a link if I had one but I only took notes and made changes to my digital models whenever I saw something I wanted to add to my design.

I saw this post in a thread and am using it here since this thread is about front bumbers...
"Instead of relocation brackets, if you can get/find a 2" thick piece of steel or Alum. Square tubing (or close to it, and space with washers), you can cut a 4-5" section and use that as 'spacer'. The bumper brackets stay where they currently are, and this sits on top of it where the bumper would usually go (and bumper on thop of the spacer). Then you get 8mm (1.25 thread) x 70mm bolt from Home Depot ($1 ea). This wil get you back together for no/little cost"

My question: is this true? I'm adding a 2" BL and I already have a shrock front.

I saw this post in a thread and am using it here since this thread is about front bumbers...
"Instead of relocation brackets, if you can get/find a 2" thick piece of steel or Alum. Square tubing (or close to it, and space with washers), you can cut a 4-5" section and use that as 'spacer'. The bumper brackets stay where they currently are, and this sits on top of it where the bumper would usually go (and bumper on thop of the spacer). Then you get 8mm (1.25 thread) x 70mm bolt from Home Depot ($1 ea). This wil get you back together for no/little cost"

My question: is this true? I'm adding a 2" BL and I already have a shrock front.

That method is for raising the stock front bumper after a BL and I don't think that would work with the Shrock.

:grimmig-big:That method is for raising the stock front bumper after a BL and I don't think that would work with the Shrock.

thanks... I need to find how to raise a shrock.

:grimmig-big:

thanks... I need to find how to raise a shrock.

I know Bklyn.X did it on his Shrock maybe IM him.

I know Bklyn.X did it on his Shrock maybe IM him.

Thanks, I did just that. :wink-big:

:wink-big::grimmig-big:

thanks... I need to find how to raise a shrock.

That is how you raise the shrock.

You are basically extending the frame horns up a couple of inches so that you have something to attach the top holes of the bumper to. There have been a few people who have raised the bumper without extending the horns but I would not do it that way. It is just too easy to weld the extensions on the frame to provide as much strength as possable.

The forces involved in winching can be a lot more severe that people give it credit, and ugly things can result.

After weighing my options, I've decided not to add the 2" BL. Bottom line, staying with 32's saves me more $ and potential headaches in the long run. I'll just have another beer while yall hit the advanced trails.