2005 Xterra OffRoad Won't Start: Diagonosis [Archive] - Nissan Xterra Forum

: 2005 Xterra OffRoad Won't Start: Diagonosis


sander
03-01-2010, 02:34 PM
Ok guys so the shop I had my truck towed to said that it was the damn fuel pump. Now is it really the fuel pump? I am skeptical about this and scared to have them replace it and still not fix the issue at hand. Do you guys think it is possible? Do you think it could just be the relay and they are just telling me its the fuel pump just to hose me for a few hundred bucks? Oh and they quoted me at $591.00!!! That seemed wayyyyy high to me. But looking at fuel pump prices on the net it looks like a new one goes for about $280 give or take a few. I found a used one with 76,000 miles on it for $100.

So what are your thoughts do you think that it could really be the pump? If so how hard is it too change a fuel pump in an xterra? I have a service manual but it is a little vague. Any info or opinions would be greatly appreciated!

soccerbrace
03-01-2010, 02:59 PM
Go back to the last thread you created and re-read it. Your answer is in there.

sander
03-02-2010, 11:19 AM
Well i know it sounded like everyone thought it was electrical or relay related. I really don't think the fuel pump is turning on. So in that case it is the fuel pump relay like we talked about before but no one ever said where the relay is? So I guess that would be a great start if I could find the relay? So if any one knows where the fuel pump relay is (specific location) that would be awesome! The page in the service manual that shows the relay does not show it's position so it is useless!

So that being said I am going to go to my truck tonight and I guess I will take a look see if I can't find it.

soccerbrace
03-02-2010, 11:21 AM
The answer is still in the last thread. Look at my posts

http://i202.photobucket.com/albums/aa108/svtflightning/Toyota_MR2.jpg

soccerbrace
03-02-2010, 11:29 AM
Look at your top row of fuses-do you see where the one on the drivers side is? 20A fog lamp?

Ok, locate that. You see the black relays below it? from left to right, consider those

A-B-C-D-E

and then continue on with the lower 4

F-G-H-I

E is the ignition relay,

and

G- is the ECM relay.

I have seem both of those go out.

The ECM relay is what I was referring to as the fuel pump relay and that is what I suspect is the problem. The ECM relay controls the fuel pump

F is your rear window defogger

G is your ECM relay.

If your rear window defogger is working, then that relay is working.

If that relay is working, you can attempt to swap those two. If you swap those two and your truck works, then you know that the relay was bad.

If it does NOT work, start investigating your fuel pump.

FYI, this is a temporary fix. I do not even know (nor does the NISSAN site tell us) what amperage the relays are, so as soon as you get a chance, you need to swap them back and get the ECM relay if you can. I have heard that you must replace the entire IPDM, and I have heard that the relays are available separately.

sander
03-03-2010, 10:50 AM
But that only speaks of the ECM relay. I understand where the ECM relay is. The fuel pump relay is what im looking for? I know there is a sepreate relay for the fuel pump it is labeled in the service manual but it does not show a definite location. It confuses the hell out of me!

dejablue
03-03-2010, 11:13 AM
james try one more time!

soccerbrace
03-03-2010, 12:25 PM
Look at your top row of fuses-do you see where the one on the drivers side is? 20A fog lamp?

Ok, locate that. You see the black relays below it? from left to right, consider those

A-B-C-D-E

and then continue on with the lower 4

F-G-H-I

E is the ignition relay,

and

G- is the ECM relay.

I have seem both of those go out.

The ECM relay is what I was referring to as the fuel pump relay and that is what I suspect is the problem. The ECM relay controls the fuel pump
F is your rear window defogger

G is your ECM relay.

If your rear window defogger is working, then that relay is working.

If that relay is working, you can attempt to swap those two. If you swap those two and your truck works, then you know that the relay was bad.

If it does NOT work, start investigating your fuel pump.

FYI, this is a temporary fix. I do not even know (nor does the NISSAN site tell us) what amperage the relays are, so as soon as you get a chance, you need to swap them back and get the ECM relay if you can. I have heard that you must replace the entire IPDM, and I have heard that the relays are available separately.

Re-read

Bluegrassen
03-04-2010, 02:30 PM
Why did you start a new thread? Anyways I don't believe there is a serviceable fuel pump relay I believe its built into your IPDM or ECM. However there is a fuel pump fuse and I'm pointing to it in this picture. (15a) sixth one over from the left on top row, blue.
http://i95.photobucket.com/albums/l146/Bluegrassen/de418023.jpg
What we are trying to tell you is to swap the ECM relay & the fog lamp relays that I'm pointing at in this picture.
http://i95.photobucket.com/albums/l146/Bluegrassen/e4568d10.jpg
Check the fuse but also swap those two relays and see if it will start.

soccerbrace
03-04-2010, 03:45 PM
Don't you mean swap the ECM relay with the rear defogger relay?

Bluegrassen
03-04-2010, 04:06 PM
Don't you mean swap the ECM relay with the rear defogger relay?

Should't matter, all we'er trying to do is see if the ECM relay is bad. They should all be the same. Right?

soccerbrace
03-04-2010, 04:09 PM
I can't see the pic. All I know is that the one to the left of the ECM is the rear window defogger. :)

dezurtrat
03-04-2010, 05:26 PM
My head hurts!

soccerbrace
03-04-2010, 05:37 PM
My head hurts!

What is "Honey, can we have sex?"?

dejablue
03-04-2010, 05:40 PM
james draw him a picture!

dezurtrat
03-04-2010, 06:09 PM
What is "Honey, can we have sex?"?


:rofl-big:

Bluegrassen
03-10-2010, 02:36 PM
Wonder if o'boy got his X started. I was kinda curious as to the problem.

sander
03-11-2010, 03:46 PM
ok so here was the deal. The first repair shop I brought it too said it was the fuel pump like i stated my other post. After reading considering carefully the advice given here by seasoned nissan experts I decided that it would be best to listen to a nissan tech rather then a local repair shop that has a second business as a wrecker service in the same building.

So from the repair shop I had it origianlly towed too (which was the closest one I knew of) i had it towed to my normal repair shop which was 14.79 miles away. Luckily I had AAA tow coverage for up to 15 miles! Just made it. I trust this guy because i have dealt with him for years and he lets me supply my own parts if i can get them cheaper little things like that go a long way in my book. I told him what everyone said on here about it being electrical and not the fuel pump it self. So he tested everything and found that there was power at the fuel pump relay under the hood but there was no power at the fuel pump it self. Now this is up for debate wheather there was a problem with ECM itself or if it was a spliced wire some where. So what he did was run a new wire from the relay to the fuel pump instead of digging through the wireing diagram trying to find the fuel pump wire. This worked just fine.

So instead of costing me 500 - 600 i only spent 200.
I have some mechical know how but when it comes down to it I would rather pay some one the 200 to fix it then to fix it my self cuz i would have gone bonkers trying to figure that one out.

So your advice was and is greatly appreciated! Even though I could not find it myself it still saved me the extra time and money fixing the wrong thing

J Everett
03-11-2010, 03:50 PM
So your advice was and is greatly appreciated! Even though I could not find it myself it still saved me the extra time and money fixing the wrong thing

Glad you got her up running, mate! :wink-big:

soccerbrace
03-11-2010, 04:43 PM
Glad you got it running, but I wish you would have just read closer. There is no fuel pump relay. There is an ECM relay. The ECM relay controls the fuel pump. There is another relay right next to the ECM relay, and that controls your rear defogger. I think that the ECM relay was bad, and all you had to do was switch those 2 relays to test it. If it started, then you would just have to replace the relay. easy. Sound like he did some bypass BS so that switched power runs the fuel pump. Oh well. Glad it's running.

soccerbrace
03-11-2010, 04:44 PM
"So he tested everything and found that there was power at the fuel pump relay under the hood but there was no power at the fuel pump it self"

Doesn't that sound like the relay to you?

J Everett
03-11-2010, 05:21 PM
"So he tested everything and found that there was power at the fuel pump relay under the hood but there was no power at the fuel pump it self"

Doesn't that sound like the relay to you?

Sounds like it to me, but if the relay was bad, wouldn't the ECM not power on either?

aznboihoy03
03-11-2010, 05:41 PM
LOL, i really enjoyed this thread :D

Bluegrassen
03-12-2010, 06:19 AM
Glad you got it running but imo your going to be dealing with this issue again sooner or later.

soccerbrace
03-12-2010, 08:16 AM
Sounds like it to me, but if the relay was bad, wouldn't the ECM not power on either?

Nah, that is just typical behavior of a second gen.

The OP never mentioned if he tried to simulate a relay with a few wires. It is not hard to do that. You can just make a couple of jumper wires, and some grounds, and make it work. If it did, then you have a bad relay.

dejablue
03-13-2010, 06:06 PM
so he payed 200dl for wiring and he is still using the bad relay?

J Everett
03-13-2010, 06:19 PM
Nah, that is just typical behavior of a second gen.

The OP never mentioned if he tried to simulate a relay with a few wires. It is not hard to do that. You can just make a couple of jumper wires, and some grounds, and make it work. If it did, then you have a bad relay.

Gotcha. That's good to know, seeing as how I own a 2nd gen. In case the problem ever crops up. Thanks, bro!

GmanTX
04-28-2010, 10:43 AM
Just want to thank everyone.
I had the stall, restart, sputter and die symptoms. Researched this forum and switched out the ECM relays with the Fog Lamp relay and it started right up. Going to order a new IPDM today. Hopefully the new boards have corrected the problems that is causing the relay to fail.

soccerbrace
04-28-2010, 11:04 AM
See if you can just order an ECM relay instead. WAYYYYYY cheaper, and that is all that is wrong.

GmanTX
05-06-2010, 11:50 AM
Thought about just going with the relay but saw that you generally have to mod them and such. I also didn't just want to keep burning through relays if the IPDM is rapidly failing and causing them to burn out more often. I got my new IPDM from eNissanParts.com for $115.00 including shipping. It took me 5 minutes to install. When you are doing this make sure to have a small tuning screwdriver so you can depress the locking tab on the connectors. Don't worry about marking the connectors as no two connectors have the same plug style, each will only plug into the slot made for it. After the change out the X started right up and is running like a champ. The IPDM part # is 284B6-ZC00A and is listed as a Controller Assembly.
I guess the silver lining on swapping the unit completely is that I've got spare relays and fuses galore. LOL
Once again thanks for all the excellent advice.


Update 02/27/2011- After Nissan issued the recall for the bad individual relay; I worked with the Nissan recall center for reimbursement on the replacement IPDM unit I purchased prior to the recall. They did require me to go to the Nissan dealer to have the recalled relay replaced by the dealer even though I had a new IPDM unit ,but, that was so they could have the necessary paperwork for the claim. Went to the dealer had the relay replaced in 15 minutes, no charge of course, and within 3 weeks of submitting all the necessary paperwork to the recall renter I had a check from Nissan for the full cost of the IPDM unit I replaced. Kudos to Nissan for making the reimbursement a streamlined and painless process.



2005 Nissan Xterra SE
2 Wheel Drive (Don't Laugh, I was living in Florida when I bought it)
48,000 miles

ntech
05-19-2010, 09:04 AM
switching the ecm relay and rear defog almost always works. it's a 5min fix that I have used tons of times for Xterras, Path, Armada, Titans, and Front. They all have the same IPDM issue.